Scott Phillips, Orix Capital Partners | How to Focus on the Things That Matter in Private Equity

Sean Mooney:
Welcome to the Karma School of Business podcast. In this episode, we have a fantastic conversation with Scott Phillips, managing director portfolio operations with ORIX Capital Partners. This episode is brought to you today by BluWave. I'm Sean Mooney, BluWave's founder, and CEO BluWave is the go-to expert of those with expertise. BluWave connects proactive business builders, including more than 500 of the world's leading private equity firms and thousands of proactive companies to the very best service providers for their critical variable on point and on-time business needs. Enjoy.

Scott, very excited to have you join us today. Thank you.

Scott Phillips:
Oh, thank you, Sean. It's excellent. Appreciate the opportunity.

Sean Mooney:
Well, jumping right in. I always love these conversations. I get to meet really interesting people who have a unique path to private equity, and that maybe wasn't the case so many years ago, but today people are coming in from all these different vantages. So maybe start off, I'd love to hear a little bit of your origin story, the backstory, how you came up in your career and how you ultimately ended up in private equity.

Scott Phillips:
Sure, Sean. Not a traditional path through private equity. I think we see that more and more when you think about adding the operational disciplines to private equity firms. Personally, I wanted to be an engineer growing up and always attracted to that discipline. So I went to engineering school, electrical and computer engineering and got my first job at Motorola. And this was what Motorola's Motorola. So as a fresh out engineer, I mean, it was just the place to be and to work, and I love that experience.

And then at some point in any career you have to make a decision, do I want to be going into management leadership or do I want to stay in discipline, technical engineering discipline. So I decided to go to the manager track fast track through my career. I had different assignments here and there. And then I had an opportunity to go back to business school, went to Kellogg, and then I graduated in 2008, which was a tough year to graduate business school in.

Sean Mooney:
Something happened that year, I'm trying to remember. It seems very familiar to now, but different.

Scott Phillips:
So personally I thought about going into consulting at that time, but it was a difficult job environment and I had an opportunity to escape overseas. So I joined a German company, Continental, and I worked in Berlin and I spent a lot of time in Europe and in Asia, mainly in China doing automotive components, mainly in the hybrid electric vehicle space. It was a very hot investment space at the time and it still is.

So fast-forward, great experience internationally, continued to develop leadership skills, managing different groups and businesses and came back to the states. And at that time a mentor that was also in private equity got involved with the firm I'm at now, and they were looking to really build out an operational discipline and bring in younger guys, non-traditional guys to lead that group and got tapped on the shoulder, always had an interest in private equity, thought this would be something later on in my career more traditionally that I would do, but had the opportunity. He put in my resume and here I am and just absolutely love it.

Sean Mooney:
That's great. And I mean it's a great path coming through those roles to really understand how a business works. And I've always thought as someone who was a business undergrad, I always knew as the engineers were the smart people with the work ethic in college.

Scott Phillips:
Maybe not the best social skills.

Sean Mooney:
I didn't have those either, but I didn't have class on Friday, so that helped. But it's an amazing degree as you think about being a business builder, it's fundamentally understanding how things work and why they work and having that Socratic method in your mind.

Scott Phillips:
I think so. I think so. That's one thing that the engineering discipline teaches you is problem solving. And then if you look at the mid-market and the opportunity to generate value, it's really about solving problems and then figuring out the best solutions to those problems. So that's been a general approach to mine is going to the solutions like that. And thinking about it from an engineering mindset.

Sean Mooney:
You've had this extremely renaissance career in many ways that very few people have. And one way is, and I think probably the most impactful way that I understand you're famous in certain areas is this industrial model. Can you share a little bit about that?

Scott Phillips:
Well, through your career as mine has taken many paths in a private equity, I did have a short stint as a industrial model.

Sean Mooney:
I can tell.

Scott Phillips:
Got more of the face for podcasting. But the story goes like this. I was sitting in my office and my boss calls, he says, "Hey, I need you go to market report for the marketing team of the corporation and the products that you're managing." Said, "Okay." Put together a report. He'll get a phone call from the media agency, say, "Hey, we want to take you in and show your product and everything." So they did a video and took a lot of pictures of me and then my face starts showing up in these industrial magazines and then my hands with the product itself. So it actually became a hand model.

And it got exciting because I actually was on the cover of the annual report for the company. Now mind you, I'm not getting any extra income for this at all. So it was purely for fun. But when they did earnings report, they posted the annual report on the famous NASDAQ billboard in New York City in Times Square there. Sure enough, there's my face and everything, so I've got a picture of it. So that's the pinnacle of my modeling career, albeit short after that and mean what else is there to do. So I give up that career.

Sean Mooney:
Reached the summit of industrial modeling and the good news, after spending a career, my career in private equity, I learned about this term that we use a lot called optionality. If something doesn't go right, you can do something else and still be successful. So it sounds like if this PE gig doesn't work, you can always go back.

Scott Phillips:
I kept those relationships. Never burned a bridge.

Sean Mooney:
You've got your portfolio, you're ready to go. And so that's amazing. Well, thanks for sharing that. That's I think something that certainly people in certain areas knew about, but now the broader world does.

Scott Phillips:
Well if you want to look it up, it's online or something like that.

Sean Mooney:
So part of that, no doubt, it impacted your ability to assess businesses. And what I'd love to drill down on is that you've had these great varied experiences as you built your career. Now as an operating executive at a private equity firm, I always had my own yardstick of this is what I look for. That's good. And things that could be good. So as you go into prospective investments, you look at investments that you've made, what's your yardstick, the things that you look for in companies that say this is or could be a really good business?

Scott Phillips:
I think first of all, it starts with the industry itself and the tailwinds and the real rationale behind why we're making the investment. And that's the way I always think about it. We partner very closely with our investment team, our deal guys, and they really go through why we make the investment. And then from the operations side, we say, "well, how are we going to do that?" But you really need to have a market with strong tailwinds, strong backlog to really understand how the company makes money and to make sure it's a sustainable path forward on that. And it's not a bunch of hype, but a true sustainable business model with good customers and tailwinds. So that's a number one. Without that, you don't really have a business long-term.

Second thing I really look for is the leadership just critical, especially at the CEO level, the vision of the company and then those number two lieutenants at the company, how well does that team jive? And we talk a lot about the human capital, how important it is. I'm a very strong believer in that. The difference when we have a portfolio company with the right leadership team in the wrong is night and day. And really having a team that's in it to win it, that really understands the PE model that's after the prize and really motivated by that, I mean they really can take that business and transform it and drive it.

And I think that's the third thing is really and struggle with that depending on what type of companies you invest in private equity, but to understand the private equity model and specifically for us partnering with that management team to really driving the initiatives to go forward and in that mode of partnership, so a leadership team with confidence that accepts the influence that we have and the direction that we want to jointly do together with the team and that open relationship, I think that's key. If that breaks down, then usually there's a lot of trouble as well.

Sean Mooney:
That makes a ton of sense. And as you think about it rings so true because the market always wins. If you've got a great team in a lousy market, it doesn't matter how good they are, you just can't win. So if you have that precondition, a lot of great things, magical things can happen if you combine it with a really top-notch team. The lessons you think about the business leaders listening to this podcast is what do you do if you're not in a good market? How do you do it? And it seems like, at least from my perspective, you better find that proverbial pivot if you're in a systematically declining market. It's like the sell the mills moment and a thing. So if you see a business and they're not in the great market, is there anything that you can do or is it just saying it's just maybe they can do it, but it's not for your firm, for us?

Scott Phillips:
No, no. We have experience business like that in the declining market, or we're just not winning either a new technology and the market's been disruptive. And that's tough. You could have the best management team like you said, without that. So I think you really got to spend time strategically on the business. And then if we really need to look and see where the market is going and how to pivot, and really is it adding additional service lines that we're not offering now that could be additional revenue streams to the business? Is it a particular customer concentration issue where if that customer dies, then we're in big trouble? How do we really pivot is an organic solution or an inorganic solution to that? So I think you really got to challenge it with a good strong strategic plan and then that leadership team to deliver on it. So it's really that.

Sean Mooney:
I think that makes a lot of sense. And you talk about there's always something you can do. You can take action if your market is declining, look forward, see where that's happening, start pivoting, start entering new adjacent markets in terms of how do you get ahead and find where the water is rising. That makes ton of sense. What about on the leadership team side? Are there things that you look for, traits or signals or almost like little intuitive observations where you say, this is a really good team?

Scott Phillips:
It really is. I think when I reflect on that, it's teams that really drive to win and that act as a team in that approach. And again, it all starts at the top with the leadership. First thing is that leader really driving forward, realizing what the business is proactively addressing those issues, not letting them lie and going after it and then really holding his lieutenants or her lieutenants accountable to the actions that they have. And it's just the basic strong leadership that you see in strong companies that are proactively just driving it and going forward. And then how they behave as a team too. We spend a lot of time with team dynamics and coaching and making sure that everyone's just aligned specifically to that.

Sean Mooney:
I really like that. And a lot of people don't call out that whole winning thing and you can have a great team, but if they get stuck, they stop. They don't figure out a way to go around an obstacle, go around trouble, take action. You got to have that idea that you're going to prevail and you're going to win. It's interesting, even as I reflect on the evolution of BluWave, and we spent a lot of time thinking really proactively about what should our culture be and the first three things we thought, what would be the best company? It's like you work as a team, you are curious and you have a growth mentality and you have good values, you're good people.

And that was the first year of the business and we're like, we're just missing something. This is all great, but it's not clicking. And then we got together as a team and we whiteboarded it and we said, what we're missing is this whole concept of winning. You got to put points on the board and you can check it with teamwork and having good values and a growth mindset, but unless you're also winning, it's just you're not going to move the ball forward. So very few people call that out. And I think that's winning.

Scott Phillips:
Most of us like to play for winners, win for winners, be on winning teams, and I think that's a culture that feeds on itself. So teams that are able to overcome the challenges ahead of them and drive forward and continuously win, it just feeds. And that's where you really see excitement in the business.

Sean Mooney:
Attracts other people. And then that flywheel just starts spinning faster.

Scott Phillips:
Starts spinning. I'm a big believer in that flywheel effect.

Sean Mooney:
Absolutely.

Scott Phillips:
Again, if the industry isn't solid, then you're running a lot of challenges, but if you have that and you have the right team,

Sean Mooney:
I think that's a hundred percent right. And so thinking about that and building value and the world in private equity has certainly evolved where maybe in my earlier days in PE it was we're going to buy low, do a couple things, and sell high. We would upgrade the accounting system and add a salesperson, and then I'd spike the ball like, "Man, I see the world in slow motion. I'm a business genius." Little did I know. And then econ 101 occurred, right? More money came in, same supply of deals, purchase price up returns to go down, but private equity people, they're not just going to let the gravity of econ 101 impact their results. They're going to do everything they can to defy the gravity. And so value creation is something that's really important right now. And it shows why the industry and firms like ORIX are bringing in people like you, true business leaders who can create inherent value. How does ORIX approach value creation and what is your angle towards this?

Scott Phillips:
no, I think you're exactly right. And the higher, of course these multiples continue to climb, the more and more you got to focus on the value creation. So the way we approach it gets back to the strategic plan and that alignment that we have with the management team. So going into a deal we usually before, unless it's a very fast process, sit down with the management team and already frame out, okay, here's the four or five things that we're going to really focus on during this investment cycle. We call them the critical few as opposed to the plentiful many. So we really focus on these and then after close we really redefine what those are and then get the right metrics in place in the action plans on an annual basis. And that drives our value creation path forward. We think if we execute on these, then we will be in a position where we need to be. So that's the first and foremost staple of that, and then we get it approved by the board and it gets reviewed at the board. So there's a governance aspect of that as well.

So once we get that going, my team is structured with generalists, but we all have a specific discipline, I thought, what do we really need to drive it? So for example, we have a generalist that also drives our procurement supply chain initiatives. So he also drives value creation across the portfolio in that particular discipline, but then also specifically at a company. And same thing with insurance or business processes, ERP, and then we have a human capital person as well that just drives that culture in the companies. Yes, we focus on that.

And then third thing is we really drive specific initiatives. So is there a specific thing where we bring in a we'll call BluWave, we'll say, "Hey, we got a particular value idea here. Do we have someone that we can call that's an expert here? Let's bring in the expert third party consultant." And then we have a specific project with the timeline with the deliverable that we just drive and make happen. And that's part of the plan. And that may or may not be part of the strategic plan depending on the needs, but that's a specific initiative that we drive.

Sean Mooney:
I really like that approach where you're aligning goals and objectives before you start going. It's not just running forward and hoping you're going the right way. So let's see where we want to be X years down the road, let's work, but then bring resources. And you're covering the 80% within your firm, you're covering a much greater percent of your portfolio company resources, but the value added resources that ORIX is providing people that also have a pretty broad set of capabilities, but then expertise in particular areas where you can come in and say with repetition, this is where you can be best in class.

Scott Phillips:
That's correct. And we develop a cross portfolio playbooks of those specific disciplines where we think there's enough value to be added.

Sean Mooney:
And then on that 20% that no one can cover, you're going to bring in best in class experts. And that's what really good businesses do. And so I think the way that you're doing this makes a hundred percent sense, and it's a true value add to your portfolio companies who are trying to transform their companies in three to six years with probably anyone in PE, there's very little room for you have to be successful. So that's a tremendous asset for these companies that have people like you and your team that can come in as custodians or value added support in those areas.

Scott Phillips:
Of course. And again, it's always in the spirit of a partnership and it needs to be that alignment clearly at the strategic plan, the board level, to really drive these things forward with the management team.

Sean Mooney:
And how do you manage that interplay between you and your team and the CEOs and their teams to make sure you're symbiotically working well together?

Scott Phillips:
No, that's a very good question. That's the whole key to it. And I think we do that originally with building that strong relationship and the rapport as a trusted partner. I mean, there's a reason why it's operating partner and the partner is really on the partnership with the CEOs. And I think it's that and the constant communication. So usually we set up a cadence where it's a more small group, meaningful meeting, here's where we're at now, here's where we need to be, what do you think? What should we focus on? What are you focusing on? What can we do together? And that open rapport and dialogue, and it's just an ongoing process of that. So you really just have to build that right up front for sure. And then continue that through the life cycle.

Sean Mooney:
I like that. And because I grew up in Texas, I only know how to view the world through cliches and metaphors and things like that. And so as I hear you discuss this, it's like I'm on Sunday and I'm getting ready to watch a football game. And you guys get your game plan together, the coaches and the players, and you say, here's what we're going to do. But in the meantime, you're doing huddles through the hallway way or you're going to say, here's what everyone's going to do, break, but check back in as you ultimately try to put more points on the board than the other person.

Scott Phillips:
Exactly. And then put in the right metrics and know, I think that's important. Going back to the winning analogy and important for us is what are those key metrics that go along with this plan? And then are we waiting? What's the score basically? What's the score?

Sean Mooney:
Yeah. And how do you think about metrics? I think something that private equity is so good at is understanding the few things that matter. Do you come into, I think as we support a lot of companies as they're trying to get more data intensive and the path that even we went on, I think everyone goes through this is the reason why the data visualization company, Tableau is called Tableau because it becomes this tableau of dashboards. How do you work with your team to say, we're going to focus on the fewer, fewer

Scott Phillips:
Ones? I mean there is a tendency to collect data for data's sake, and then you really look at it and you go, okay, but what does it tell me? I mean, what do I do with this information? So what I challenge us to do is roll up our sleeves as an operation team and go out there to actually understand what these guys need to see and visualize if you are managing the company. And then as the owner, we know what we want to see, but then really partner with them and then we bring in the expertise to say, "We're almost there. Here's the data that we can get from the systems that we implement and then here's the dashboards." We can do that. But it's really coming from them to really understand how the business works, the expertise to do that and then drive it. And again, it gets back to the critical few. So when you come up with the dashboard, what are the three to five metrics that really drive the business forward? And really thinking very strategically about those.

Sean Mooney:
I love that perspective. I love how you framed the critical few so easy to take on so much that it becomes overwhelming and then it's almost hard to hold yourselves and others accountable because there's so many things. And so I love your approach where you're like, you're going in, we're going to try to do fewer things better, and then we're going to measure and monitor it. And I know just even from our own personal perspective, the results can be profound. And the hard part I found even as an operator of our own business is when I was in PE it's like, "Oh, [inaudible 00:20:41], find your key measures. Tell us what they are. How hard could that be?" And now that I'm in this seat, I'm like, it's hard.

Scott Phillips:
It's hard.

Sean Mooney:
It's hard to find those few that matter, but it forces you to really understand your business.

Scott Phillips:
It does. And then I put it just a soft rule, but we live by it at the board level, no more than 20, period. And then it really thinks what are the 20 critical ones? And then from a governance standpoint, we report all 20 in the appendix. We have graphics and way we present it, we like to present it. That's success. But then if there's any that are, let's say yellow, big believer in red, yellow, green, simple indicators, then that gets a page in the board deck, just private discipline and government.

Sean Mooney:
And I'm sure if you see all green, you're like, you're not trying hard enough.

Scott Phillips:
That's right. [inaudible 00:21:32]

Sean Mooney:
We get green, a lot of green on our quarterly meetings, we're not trying hard enough. It's all green. And if we do quarterly engagement studies with our team, if we're getting all tens, let's try harder.

Scott Phillips:
I mean, it's very simple, the concept, but it drives I think the right behavior.

Sean Mooney:
I love that. And so as you think about this operating philosophy, you think about what's happening today and we're in this strange N equals one economy. It's like it's growing, but it's not. There's a 1980s style inflation, but 3.5% unemployment. It's something that's this very odd mercurial environment that we're living in. As you think about your own portfolio companies and interacting with them, one of the things that I think is real easy in human nature we talk about before in our conversation is it's easy to circle the wagons and stop and wait for this choppy weather to go past. But as we talk about, you got to continue to make progress, you got to continue to act. How are you working with your portfolio companies to not only help them lay the groundwork to be safe and secure, but also find opportunities for success?

Scott Phillips:
no, it's a great question. It is a very interesting environment. I mean, we have labor-intensive businesses at ORIX. So the labor market has been very challenging, difficult, the inflationary pressure, especially our businesses that have long-term MSA contracts that are fixed price has been brutal trying to fight our way through that. And I think you've got to be proactive in thinking the worst is ahead. Back to the winning analogy, the team we play this week, they're really good. So we got an upper game and having that edge to you.

So our biggest focus these days is cash, to be honest with you, with the price now of the debt and servicing that debt and how much cash we have. So we're monitoring very closely where our cash is going. We're really scrutinizing the capital we're investing and then really driving a discipline of what is that ROI that we're actually getting on this? Is this the right thing to do at this point in time or not? And then if it is the right thing, then making sure that we execute strongly on those things. So we're not stop growth and investing, we're just being more and more cautious about it. And then I think cash is king for sure. So really monitoring the cash flows and understanding where is it flowing, where can we tidy up? And we have tightened the belt just to get the companies, they're not in trouble, but just to get them ready for any rough water ahead.

Sean Mooney:
I think that's right on in terms of good companies or bad companies don't go out of business because they're good or bad per se. They go out of business, they run out of cash. We've seen it certainly with a lot of the businesses that are on we're going to burn trajectory in hopes of or with a goal of reaching orbit in a moonshot and we're going to grow at all costs. But at the end of the day, I think about caches, it's the fuel in your tank and if you run out of it, you're going right into the drink.

Scott Phillips:
Yeah. So that beautiful, I mean, for example, you got two projects, one sky of the moon, but it's a networking capital sock. Is that something we really want to do at this time or maybe we hold off and look at some other projects to execute that [inaudible 00:24:48]?

Sean Mooney:
Particularly we've been in this economy, I love your perspective on this. For 15 years it's been all gas, no breaks, and largely because-

Scott Phillips:
Really cheap money.

Sean Mooney:
... Fed policy, right? It's like the post-Bernanke fed, we're going to keep interest rates low and print lots of money and everything will be good, but eventually that causes this. Too much of anything good thing causes a hangover. And here we are. And so if you think about what's happened is a lot of really good companies are getting back to basics and what does that do as you think about not only the companies in the now, but how that'll impact and support their success as we come out of this, which we will

Scott Phillips:
No, that's exactly right. That's why we really have the discipline of, and that's a key metric we really drive is what does your fixed cost structure look like? And then constantly driving that discipline of every year, let's see if we can get better and better in terms of our fixed cost ratio as a percentage of revenue and just driving a discipline to get more and more in shape and lean. And then when the times pop back up, we're just going to be a much better position to capture where it is. Keeping those balance sheets strong to jump on those opportunities as they present themselves in organically.

Sean Mooney:
I almost think, once again, one of these metaphors is I view the world through, it's like through the last 15 years we've been on my post summer, eat everything and Christmas cheer and put on weight.

Scott Phillips:
Guilty of that.

Sean Mooney:
But then I usually will give it time until January to embrace reality. But then February I get on a scale, I go, "Oh my God, I've got to reign in the chaos." And then I'm better for it in the rest of the year. But you got to go through these periods. It's easy to get, I'll call it for me, fat and happy during the good times, but then you got to tighten it up.

Scott Phillips:
You got to tighten it up. Yeah. We have a say in our firm that comes from really the founder of this whole operating philosophy. He says, "Fixed cost is high blood pressure. You don't have it until it's too late, then it'll kill you."

Sean Mooney:
And these companies, they're going to get leaner and meaner and they're going to come out of this malaise is so much better and rock it right out. And so that's the thing that I think is so easy to get really lost in the fear. But there's this great saying that I've probably been saying for three years since COVID, but it's like, this too shall pass. And just the bad things, the good times will pass too. And it sounds like what you are doing is getting them ready to address the reality, but they're going to come out of this like banshees rocketing.

Scott Phillips:
Yeah. I think it is. I think it's anticipating the worst and hopefully for the best, but make sure you're anticipating the worst.

Sean Mooney:
This too shall passes as I say. And so, one of the things that I love being able to have conversations with people like you, Scott, is you've got all these varied perspectives and I'm very well documented saying like, oh my god, if life and business wrote up to me, I'd be in a lot of trouble. So every day working with people like you and your team, I learn things I didn't know you should be doing that. And why didn't I know this thing? It's like common knowledge is not common in my life. And so every day I get to learn these great things and I find myself, I wish I knew that. Or there's some things that if you were to go back and meet the younger supermodel Scott self-

Scott Phillips:
The industrial model, I would've [inaudible 00:28:05] in that career.

Sean Mooney:
What would you share with yourself?

Scott Phillips:
I think, and it gets back to that same saying, we just said this too shall pass, is resilience. I think people that have resilience and then flexibility to really adapt to the situations presented to you and maximize those opportunities. I think early in my career I had some challenges. It may have woe me or how do I really get through this and really learn resilience over time when you really realize difficult times happen. Those are difficult times of opportunity of real growth and development. And if you can learn resiliency and flexibility, then I think that proves very successful later on. So I think that's my 2 cents in terms of if I were to told myself a little earlier, embrace the tough times, the rough times that makes you sharper and better and you can really maximize opportunity during those times.

Sean Mooney:
I think that's great advice. And in this day and age, there's so much about trying to take the pain out of everything and everything's got to be good and happy and maybe culturally the US we smile and no one wants to know that there's tough times. And I think going back to your first point about having that winning mentality and everyone thinks going back, or even the flywheel, everyone thinks when something's humming and it's all good, it was all easy. But the reality, it is going through a lot of losses and a lot and winds and everything in between to get to something where that flywheel's moving at a hundred miles an hour and everyone's like, "This is great." But what it really takes your point is so essential is that resilience is nothing's easy to start and there's going to be this trajectory through humanity where people think it's like you're happy or sad. It's really a continuum of change and flux and it takes resilience to get there. And I think it ties really nicely with what you're talking about, this whole winning mentality is you got to have resilience.

Scott Phillips:
You got to have it. I mean the only other analogy I have is also a Texan live in Texas, so I got an opportunity to coach my son's flag football team and football is big in Texas, even flag football>

Sean Mooney:
Under the lights.

Scott Phillips:
It's the lights and everything else, and we make it all the way to the championship and we lose. And by the way, only the first place team gets a trophy.

Sean Mooney:
Very rare these days.

Scott Phillips:
Very rare. So it was a good lesson one for my son is you want that trophy? Well then you got to work twice as hard next year as a team and that's the that resilience you got to teach and learn I think over time. So that's the analogy I have on that one.

Sean Mooney:
I think it's a great piece of advice and that'll be something I write down. You lose perspective of all these little things that lead to that continuum of satisfaction in the world. So this has been super, super interesting and insightful and I've learned a lot, Scott, and thank you so much for your gracious donation of your time here.

Scott Phillips:
No, I really appreciate it. Thank you, Sean and all the work BluWave does helping us in our firm. I really do appreciate that as well.

Sean Mooney:
Likewise, we appreciate it and look forward to keeping in touch.

Scott Phillips:
Excellent, thank you.

Sean Mooney:
Special thanks to Scott for joining. If you'd like to learn more about Scott and ORIX Capital Partners, please see the episode notes. That's all we have for today. For more information on this podcast and BluWave, go to BluWave.net/podcast. That's B-L-U-W-A-V-E. Please continue to look for us anywhere you find your favorite podcasts, including Apple, Google, and Spotify. We truly appreciate your support. If you like what you hear, please follow, review, and share. It really helps us when you do those things, so thank you in advance. In the meantime, let us know if there's anything we can do to support your success. Onward.

Private equity insights for and with top business builders, including investors, operators, executives and industry thought leaders. The Karma School of Business Podcast goes behind the scenes of PE, talking about business best practices and real-time industry trends. You'll learn from leading professionals and visionary business executives who will help you take action and enhance your life, whether you’re at a PE firm, a portco or a private or public company.

BluWave Founder & CEO Sean Mooney hosts the Private Equity Karma School of Business Podcast. BluWave is the business builders’ network for private equity grade due diligence and value creation needs.